Group+1;+October+20

According to Ravitch, what was progressive edu? Why did it spread? How pervasive was it?


 * Dewey not the same as "child-centered"
 * Dewey--not all in for "child-centered" schools
 * life adjustment


 * for rich kids, who didn't need particular skills, mostly in NYC
 * mandated from about due to curriculum surveys, but little evidence outside ravitch for this


 * it spread with the rise of vocational ed in secondary ed--a mass institution now expanding (1940, more than 50% graduating high school)
 * make it more interesting for the increased masses by increasing participation (projects, inquiry...somewhat Deweyish w/ motivation)
 * NEA, Cubberly; working class kids in schools and IQ test prove they're dumb, so make their educ. more relevant to their lives)
 * not everyone will grow up to be white-collar, better prepare for their "destinies" ...link to depression era?
 * curriculum survey's were pre-ordained, however, elements were very inspiring to teachers
 * Kilpatrick--educated 30,000 students, "project method"
 * Milwaukee teacher's association invited Kilpatrick to MKE, was attractive--pedagogical progressivism, professionalizing

What is Ravitch's stance toward prog. ed?


 * leans anti-progresive
 * P. 74, "disagree with schools' practices"
 * p. 79, "to encourage consensus"


 * schools of ed love progressive ideas, she hates it...became antagonistic toward schools of ed, but they are a vehicle to be qualified to be a teacher in the first place
 * (Ravitch was not allowed to teach at NYU b/c her stance on progressive ed)
 * hey, NCLB is restricting curriculum with high-stakes testing


 * She love hard work, discipline, individualism
 * the best scenario is academic curricu, despite college-bound or not, expect hard work and self-discipline


 * prog. ed is more/less the devil
 * some student engagement is good, but ACADEMICS is really important!
 * uses crazy examples to support her idea with anecdotal evidence

Pedagogical progressives need really deep content knowledge

How Teachers Taught---lots of research, but a very boring book

in a pedagogical way, progressivism never really was taught

high school changes 1900-1910 elaborate set of tracks Latin becomes less important, as does ancient history development of business english, business math did teachers just not figure out how to teach "these kids" vocational ed didn't really prepare kids for skilled jobs (Japan assumes--do not believe success is preordained by intellect, no type casting; effort will get you far) (Chinese look to use for application of facts) US Universities are still widely seen as "the best in the world"

How persuasuive is Ravitch overall? Social Frontier--only 6,000 magazines in circulation at any point